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 Post subject: Soma/Hard Mode/New Game+ Speedrun Discussion
PostPosted: Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:20 pm 
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Ah, I love it. You don't have to bother with getting souls and stuff. My record is about 40 minutes. Yeah, I suck. :o

The main thing I want to discuss is when to use Valkyrie and, of course, boss strategies. Do they differ much from the boss rush tactics?

Modified New Game route from the SDA topic:

Kill Flying Armor
Activate Wizardry Lab warp
Kill Balore
Get Magic Seal 2
Activate Garden warp
(Get Doppelganger soul)
Kill Dmitrii
Kill Malphas
Activate Dark Chapel warp
Warp to Garden
Defeat Dario
Backstab into Clock Tower
Get Magic Seal 4
Kill Zephyr
Activate Clock Tower warp
Warp to Wizardry Lab
Backstab into Subterranean Hell
Kill Bat Company
Activate Silenced Ruins warp
Warp to Clock Tower
Kill Paranoia
Kill Aguni
Activate Pinnacle warp
Warp to Garden
Watch scene
Warp to Dark Chapel
Backstab into Condemned Tower
Enter Mines of Judgment
Kill Death
Enter The Abyss
Kill Abaddon
Kill Menace

Did I forget something?


Last edited by Serris on Thu Apr 26, 2007 5:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 6:07 pm 
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Time at final save: 37:29

Is sub-30 even possible?

What's a good strategy for Menace?


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 23, 2006 12:56 pm 
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I would like to help, but I don't got enough slots in my DoS (would want to copy a file and start a NG+ run on that). Also to be honest, I've kinda lost my DoS mojo since the game is pretty old already so I'm pretty much just gonna get that Julius Mode run done and that's probably it for me til PoR is out.

Hopefully others can help ya out, but it'll take some time since I gotta advertise this place (since it's still new).

If you feel it's better to talk about a NG+ run at SDA since there's already a thread there, then feel free to since this place is gonna take some time to grow. :)

Hopefully by the time PoR is out, things will become more active.

EDIT: decided to do this before Julius Mode since it should be much faster. Just need some time to think of stuff. :)


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 6:32 am 
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I got 34:19 at final save. But other than usual mistakes, I made some major ones, like forgetting to open a teleport and running all the way to Aguni before realizing I forgot about Paranoia.

I'll redo the run with effort next time. Probably aim for a finished time (yes including Menace) of under 35 mins or maybe even 34. Only thing frustrating with this run is all the soul and equipment changing for almost every room. -_-


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 12:02 pm 
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Did you take a different route or was it identical to the one I posted?


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 2:40 pm 
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Same route as you.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 3:19 pm 
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Sheesh, I guess I'm just too sucky for a single segment run ...

Anyway, here's my current "strategy" to kill Menace:

Kaladbolg
Death's Robe
Rosary

Flame Demon
Bat Company
Stolas

First Form

Turn into bat and fly up to the weak point, spam Flame Demon and keep replenishing mana with High Mind Ups and Mana Prisms. Each shot deals about 100 damage at level 28. I think this method isn't that bad, at least not when Menace releases that poisonous cloud. Maybe there's a better way involving Medusa Head, but since it blocks the guardian slot, you can't equip Devil and hack away, so ... dunno.

Second Form

Lower Head

Same tactic as for the first form.

Upper Head

Claimh Solais
Dracula's Tunic
Chaos Ring

Erinnys
Devil
Golem

Activate Devil and go nuts with Claimh Solais, maybe some Erinnys in between. If you have some mana potions left, switch Chaos Ring with Megingiord. Claimh Special has better range and is stronger, but eats mana like nothing. Again ... I have no idea what's faster.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 3:49 pm 
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Well, you could always do things multisegged. :P

How much does Erinnys do at lvl 28 on his first form?

Also dunno if this is the same as you, but I used INT setup for like 98% of the game.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 24, 2006 4:15 pm 
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INT booster: Kaladbolg, Death's Robe, Rosary, Stolas

Erinnys - 2 x 108 damage (hits twice)

Flame Demon - 103 damage

So, yeah, Erinnys is better. However, as a bat you can get away more quickly to avoid the spikes emerging from his stomach (the ceiling).

Oh, and all of my pseudo runs were multisegged. It's just that I'd like to save the saving time. Your runs are single segment, aren't they?

Quote:
Also dunno if this is the same as you, but I used INT setup for like 98% of the game.


Only for bosses. My traveling setup:

Valmanway
Dracula's Tunic
Chaos Ring

Mandragora / Great Axe Armor (nice for Medusa Heads / Imps)
Valkyrie
Draghignazzo

Usually, I try to kill as many enemies along the way as possible. Higher levels can't hurt.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 25, 2006 11:13 pm 
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New time (including Menace): 38:27

Used Erinnys + Medusa Head on first form, Erinnys for second form's lower head + Buer to repel those annoying pseudo-Langoliers, and Claimh + Devil for upper head. The skull shuts up after a hit, so Erinnys's double hits won't work.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2006 1:31 pm 
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Nah I usually prefer multisegged over singlesegged so we can lessen the overall time.

Starting a new run, but instead of aiming for a time, I'm just gonna take things slow so I can find strats for every part.

First part is from start to Balore.

At the beginning with the 3 enemies, I basically use INT build and kill them with one Killerclown each so I don't have to waste time running to them (mainly the first enemy).

Right when we enter the village I use Valkyrie all the way to Yoko (will have the transform twice due to the gap in front of boss room) and back to boss.

As for Flying Armor I use STR build and Devil soul. Basically I do attack and backdash attack right after Devil. The first hit will still be normal but the second will be Devil powered. Next room basically Flying Armor soul.

After that I use STR gear except that I also use a Chaos Ring and Death soul (I use Valmanway as the weapon). Then I turn on Death and keep running and slashing things in my way. They all should die before my body reaches them. One more spot to use Flying Armor soul.

After that basically same setup with Death. When I reach the Golem in the labs at AF,15 (you'll have the check the map coordinates at gamefaqs), I take out Death and Golem and change to Devil and Draghignazzo and walk past it while slashing (would be best to activate Devil right before dropping to the Golem room. Switch back to Death and golem and get to Balore. For Balore I use INT build with Axe Armor and Werewolf.

Any other stuff that should be added or changed? With this I don't think I have any parts where I actually have to stop running (other than Flying Armor and Balore of course).


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2006 3:54 pm 
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Quote:
At the beginning with the 3 enemies, I basically use INT build and kill them with one Killerclown each so I don't have to waste time running to them (mainly the first enemy).


I use Valmanway on the Skeleton, then activate Devil for the Knight and the Golem. You can hit them as soon as the blue "summoning pillar" stops extending.

Quote:
With this I don't think I have any parts where I actually have to stop running


Are you using Valkyrie only on the way to Yoko? I myself make heavy use of it. It's much more flexible than the AoS transformation souls.

My boss tactics:

Flying Armor: STR setup; activate Devil, jump, hit twice with Gungner, switch to Valmanway, attack as you drop back to the floor.

Balore: INT setup; Axe Armor + Werewolf

Dmitrii: INT setup; Killerclown backdash spam

Malphas: INT setup; Werewolf + Killerclown spam towards Malphas; switch to Draghignazzo, pass through him, turn around, switch to Stolas, Killerclown backdash spam; activate Valkyrie as soon as he dies.

Dario: INT setup; jump over him, turn around, use Frozen Shade, wait until it hits, switch to Killerclown, backdash spam

Zephyr: INT setup; Werewolf + Killerclown, jump over him, backdash spam

Bat Company: INT setup; Activate Buer, wait for BC to charge at you, Bomb Armor backdash spam

Mini Paranoia: INT setup; Killerclown backdash spam

Paranoia: INT setup; trigger his appearance, fill the room with slime via backdash spam, activate Alura Une and tap at him repeatedly.

Aguni: He's really giving me a hard time ... I used the Paranoia tactic, but that's not even near optimal ...

Death: INT setup; just hope he comes down and Killerclown him; finish first form off while he's on the ground so you can continue spamming after the transformation; second form is difficult to do perfect ... I use Alura Une until he summons the skulls, then hover via Medusa Head next to him and spam Erinnys. Can undoubtedly be improved.


Last edited by Serris on Sat Aug 26, 2006 5:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2006 4:31 pm 
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I like your strat for the first 3 enemies. :)
Akthough your 2nd and 3rd one is faster due to rapid slash spamming, the first should still be Killerclown since you would still have to walk to the skel if you used a weapon, which IMO throwing a card is much faster. Or is there some sould that can hit instantly?

Yeah I only use Valkyrie to Yoko and back. It's faster than running yes, but you also gotta remember that the startup is like 3 seconds, and there's not much long paths like at the beginning.

Maybe we can write up places that benefit Valkyrie soul?

But to Balore I don't see any good places to use it other than the beginning cuz the rest of the way is all zigzaged.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2006 5:20 pm 
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Quote:
Akthough your 2nd and 3rd one is faster due to rapid slash spamming, the first should still be Killerclown since you would still have to walk to the skel if you used a weapon, which IMO throwing a card is much faster. Or is there some sould that can hit instantly?


Yeah, Kilerclown on the Skeleton is faster.

Quote:
Maybe we can write up places that benefit Valkyrie soul?


Yep. You probably know that already, but unlike the AoS transformation souls, the size of Valkyrie's sprite isn't its actual size. It passes through doorways flawlessly. When it drops to a lower floor, it loses speed, but it's faster than disabling the transformation and transforming again. You can, of course, disable it instantly by switching to another Guardian Soul, so you don't have to wait for the transformation to vanish.

Oh, and I've drawn a map ... I thought of marking the Valkyrie spots, but there isn't much space ...

http://img105.imageshack.us/img105/9208/dosmapuw8.jpg


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Aug 27, 2006 11:37 am 
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Tip: When you aren't using Valkyrie, use Ukoback + Werewolf instead of walking.


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